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11-16-18 02:28 AM
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Xeogaming Forums - Debate Shrine - Why gay marriage is wrong. | | Thread closed
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User Post
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2977 days
Last activity: 1126 days
Posted on 11-21-05 12:39 AM Link
no, it's not a right. I'm not allowed to demand a wife (or husband if I so desire).

I must go and find one willing to enter into the marriage contract with me.

So, it's not a right .
Rogue
If you're reading this... You are the Resistance











Since: 08-17-04

Since last post: 2 days
Last activity: 1 day
Posted on 11-21-05 03:07 AM Link
From a neutral point:

It isn't a matter of demanding a wife or husband as it is a legal right for your spouse to be bound to you by the law, be it in sharing property, adopting/having children, taking care of matters of sickness and death, separation of belongings upon divorce, etc.

The United Nations' Universal Declaration of Human Rights decrees, "Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.

Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.

The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State."

However you define "right", it's universally accepted that this issue has been addressed as a "right" to marriage.



Now on the side note, why did this even need to be moved to Debate in the first place?
Lord Vulkas Mormonus

Vile
High Xeodent of Xeomerica.








Since: 10-29-04
From: North Carolina, United States. World, Sol System, milky way

Since last post: 324 days
Last activity: 50 days
Posted on 11-21-05 08:39 AM Link
I hate to say it Rogue, but even in that document it is not a real "right". Read it fully, and somewhere in there it says that only applies if it does not contradict what the UN is trying to do.

Also, the UN has no authority. It has a small army, but it can't inforce any of its laws, and so it isn't a real right.

Originally posted by The Politician
1. Saying someone can't be married because their gay is basically the same as saying someone can't get married because they're *insert race here*. They're people. Your a person, they're a person. All we are are people ,no higher than any other. We deserve to the same rights as another, we shouldn't be having things taken away or treated completely differently (in a different manner) because we look, think, or feel differently than another group of people. The majority. Oh well, they're gay. So what? They're just the same as you. A person. That's all. They deserve the same individuals rights as you.

2. They're expressing who they are. What's wrong with being gay openly? Are you going to attack a Jewish man for celebration his religion openly? Onoz!

3. [sigh]

As for the "So, we're making a big deal out of less than 1% of the population because they want to be "equal"?" thing, your basically saying that we shouldn't give a shit about a "minority". That since there is only a "certain percentage" of them, and it is a small percentage, that we shouldn't make a big deal about what they want. Boo-hoo, they want the right to get married. It's not like it's inflicting on you, silly goose.


#1 Actually there is no document that I have found that says we are all equal and deservin the same rights. Sure, the constitution says we are all born equal, but after birth then things are a bit different. And by the way, if we illegalize gay marriage, we would have the same right. All males have the right to marry females, and vice versa. It is all perfectly equal. And also, I have not heard of a single gay person who has even tried to stop being gay. I think if they tried, they could succeed.

#2 A jewish person is completely different from a gay person. If we can't bring in polygamy, I'm not so you should be allowed to bring in Jewish people.

Also, expressing it openly is very different from having one of those "gay pride" things. Do you see us ordinary people going around doing "straight pride" celebrations? No, because we don't feel the need to announce it to every single human currently alive. Why do they?

#3 We are in a democratic republic are we not? That means a certain amount of democracy, and that means that the majority rules. The minority fails. However, we shouldn't just ignore it because they a very small amount.

__________________________

Finally, a marriage is a goverment contract. The goverment must approve of it first, and that means that it can disapprove, and therfore that means we do not have that right.
Ϡ
This isn't about you and your loud mouth,
This is about me and my fucking beard.








Since: 08-29-04
From: PA

Since last post: 2650 days
Last activity: 2274 days
Posted on 11-21-05 10:45 AM Link
Vulkar, wow. What?!

Your view on the UN's authority is based completly on it's militiant force. There is a cultural and political the UN has that is almost unmatched. There is a thing the UN uses called "sanctions". If that happened, we'd lose almost all our oil. It'd destroy the economy, inflation, depression, deaths...


1. Yes, ever hear of a straight man trying to be gay? Dude, people are who they are. Why do you make homosexuality sound like a disease?

2.Ordinary people? Gay people are the same as straight people! And no, Jewish is not completly different from homosexuality. It is something people use to organize people, just as homosexuality is.

3. I don't want to respond to that.
Evo

Red Super Koopa
Watching you fall brings joy to my heart....








Since: 08-16-04
From: Oregon

Since last post: 3911 days
Last activity: 3851 days
Posted on 11-21-05 10:45 PM Link
Actually, Vulkar. Some gay people, when they're younger know they're different and try to hide it, try to like the other sex. But guess what, it doesn't work. (and yes, I've known someone who actually tried, he even went out with my best (chick) friend and tried making out with her and all that good stuff).

So now that you've heard of it, did you have a point to that?

And Geeogree, have you heard that voting is a right? That's why the blacks now get to vote. But they don't demand a vote. They can if they want to. Just like I can. Even though I chose not to. It was illegal for blacks to vote, and it fixed itself, just like the gay marriage thing is going to do. It's a right, you're entitled to be able to declare yourself legally devoted to one another, male or female, black/white/whatever.
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2977 days
Last activity: 1126 days
Posted on 11-22-05 01:09 AM Link
true.... but if you stopped a black person from voting.... you'd probably go to jail or something....

it's illegal...

however... if someone refuses to marry you.... you can't sue them or something.... in fact there isn't anything you can do about it
avatar of law

Beezo








Since: 12-29-04
From: paris, canada

Since last post: 3569 days
Last activity: 3569 days
Posted on 11-22-05 03:55 AM Link
Originally posted by geeogree
true.... but if you stopped a black person from voting.... you'd probably go to jail or something....

it's illegal...

however... if someone refuses to marry you.... you can't sue them or something.... in fact there isn't anything you can do about it


you know, geeogree doesnt get it.... YOU DONT GET IT! why are you bringing up a topic about what if someone doesnt want to marry you? that has nothing to do with anything remotely with what we're talking about.

we're talking about two homos who are in love, and WANTS TO GET MARRIED!

evo earlier explained it perfectly...

"i deeply love my fiance. I would get married in a heartbeat if I could have an insta-perrfect wedding. But if someone told me that I couldn't get married, it wouldn't be recognized as a legal bond, I'd be fucking pissed.
People get married all the time for other things, religion, money, whatever. But NO ONE should have any of their rights taken away because of any one difference from any other human being."

yet you go and twist it saying how it's not a right because you cant force someone to marry you. we're not talking about force. we're talking about two adults who consents and wants to get married.

and yeah, even if only 1% of the world are homosexuals, that's still at least 50 MILLION PEOPLE. that's like 1 in 4 person in the united states. but it's not just 1%, it's more than that. you cant look at it in a fraction or percentage, you must look at it in real numbers. even if our entire world's population is 5 or 6 billion people, 1 million is still a lot, heck 100,000 people are still a lot. it may not be a lot if you compare it as a whole, but it's still a lot. i doubt you'll ever even know 100,000 people in your entire life.
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2977 days
Last activity: 1126 days
Posted on 11-22-05 04:06 PM Link
uhm.... did you read the last 5 or 6 posts?

why don't you go do that then
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 282 days
Last activity: 120 days
Posted on 11-22-05 04:52 PM Link
If there was an important point in those posts that he missed, point it out instead of wasting space with a pointless post!

Or was there no missed point and you just couldn't come up with anything better?
Evo

Red Super Koopa
Watching you fall brings joy to my heart....








Since: 08-16-04
From: Oregon

Since last post: 3911 days
Last activity: 3851 days
Posted on 11-22-05 05:45 PM Link
He couldn't come up with anything better.

Obviously, Avatar did read the last few posts. You, Geeogree, were ranting about forcing people to get married and black people not being allowed to vote in responce to my post. Avatar was explaining that gay marriage should be allowed for those people who DO WANT to get married. TWO PEOPLE, BOTH of them wanting to be TOGETHER, in life, in the government, in every way possible. No one forcing anyone.

Where did you get this "forced marriage" idea anyway?

And double on what Tamarin said. If you feel someone missed some posts : SUMMARIZE!
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2977 days
Last activity: 1126 days
Posted on 11-22-05 07:26 PM Link
yay tamarin.... eat a dick AGAIN!



if people would pay attention they would understand what I'm saying

I'm not suggesting forcing marriage on anyone.... however, since you can't actually enforce marriage on someone (you can't demand the opportunity to get married even if no one is willing.... if you can't find someone to marry you, then tough, you don't get married)

my point was that marriage is not a right....
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 282 days
Last activity: 120 days
Posted on 11-22-05 07:30 PM Link
... you're really pushing your luck, geeogree. I hope you realize this.

But anyway, Evo (in her last sentence) and I (in my entire fucking post) were talking about the following post that you made in this thread.


uhm.... did you read the last 5 or 6 posts?

why don't you go do that then

geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2977 days
Last activity: 1126 days
Posted on 11-22-05 07:32 PM Link
obviously the point of what I was saying didn't register with Avatar.....

would you have spelled it out for him again Tamarin? not bloody likely.... you would have told him the same thing I did.... and you know it
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 282 days
Last activity: 120 days
Posted on 11-22-05 07:37 PM Link
Oh? How high you place yourself to believe you know the mind of others! Such is a peak only the fool aspires to, for the sage knows it can never be reached. Put in simpler terms, you do not know how I would react in any given situation, so do not pretend to.

Besides which, one could easily say that you're not seeing the point of what he is saying. Especially since, while he did respond to your point (see below quote), you have yet to respond to his.


Originally posted by avatar of law
yet you go and twist it saying how it's not a right because you cant force someone to marry you. we're not talking about force. we're talking about two adults who consents and wants to get married.


Edit: Added a clarifying statement.

Edit2: What the fuck? I thought the quotes were changed here.

Edit3: Fixed it.


(Last edited by Tamarin Calanis on 11-22-05 10:39 PM)
Xeoman

Wizzrobe
Administrator








Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 4 days
Last activity: 3 days
Posted on 11-22-05 08:50 PM Link
Closed.

Due to request and simply because it's gotten too edgy.
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Xeogaming Forums - Debate Shrine - Why gay marriage is wrong. | Thread closed



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