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11-18-18 04:30 PM
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Xeogaming Forums - Debate Shrine - Holiday Spirit? | |
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Elara

Divine Mamkute
Dark Elf Goddess
Chaos Imp
Penguins Fan

Ms. Invisable








Since: 08-15-04
From: Ferelden

Since last post: 9 days
Last activity: 9 days
Posted on 12-01-05 04:53 PM Link | Quote
So it's Christmas/Yule/Hanukah/Kwanza/whatever season again and the malls are packed with people fighting over "sale items" and fretting over if they have enough money to get something for everyone and all that... my mom is complaining about the whole holiday season because of money.

So here is my debate point: Do you think that this season has gotten too commercial? Why or why not? How do you think we can fix it?
Makura









Since: 01-22-05
From: The restaurant at the end of the universe....

Since last post: 3691 days
Last activity: 2956 days
Posted on 12-01-05 05:06 PM Link | Quote
I have friends who say they are "skipping" Christmas because they have no money to buy presents. That's when i basically smack myself in the forehead. That is not what this season is about people.

I'll admit, I'm pretty spoiled around Christmas time, I enjoy the presents, but my family gets so wrapped up in the fact that we all got what we wanted and by the end of the day we're all in seperate rooms ignoring eachother.

My ideal Christmas? Sitting in front of a warm fireplace appreciating my friends and loved ones.

I agree with you Elara this season has gotten way too comercialized. What happen to the days when buying one gift for your kid was acceptable.. Me? I get like 50.. I understand my family is fortunate enough to do so, but c'mon people let's use this Holiday to appreciate what we already have.
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 284 days
Last activity: 123 days
Posted on 12-01-05 05:11 PM Link | Quote
Too commercial? Yeah. (you gave a reason, and I have one further down) Can we do anything about it? That depends on whether you mean 'do we have the ability' or 'could it possibly happen'. We're capable of putting a stop to this, but the simple fact is that not enough people would bother trying.

It's not so bad when people are buying gifts when they aren't expected to, or parents getting things for their kids, but... well, when someone feels obligated to get something for someone and has to worry about one person's gift seeming insignificant compared to another, that's a bad thing.

And for the record, I've only bought one gift for anyone this season, and I'm probably leaving it at that - another copy of Pokemon Silver for my cousin Sammy since the save battery died in his. He also already received this.
Elara

Divine Mamkute
Dark Elf Goddess
Chaos Imp
Penguins Fan

Ms. Invisable








Since: 08-15-04
From: Ferelden

Since last post: 9 days
Last activity: 9 days
Posted on 12-01-05 10:14 PM Link | Quote
I agree that it is a good thing when someone gets you something and you were not expecting anything... that's actually kind of sweet... but it's like kids expect to have a shitload of presents from their parents and everyone else and they get all pissy when they don't get it. Kinda like Dudley Dursley in the first Harry Potter book if you know what I mean, that whole hissy fit because he didn't get as many presents as last year.

I just wish that human nature didn't spoil everything. I mean, the holiday is about drawing together, about warmth and joy and a light in the darkness, be it the candles on a menorah (sp?), the yule log on the fire, or a shining star in the sky. I grew up celebrating a Christmas that was all about money, sure there was some family togetherness (at my grandparents); but it became all about money as I got older. I'd spend my birthday and early christmas money on gifts for my friends and I'd get bitched at for it by my parents, that's right, I got bitched at for being selfless. When I became a Wiccan it felt purer to me, simpler... even though I still celebrate Christmas for apperances, I call it Yule and I do my best to not see it as "I need to get this person a gift, and this person, etc"

I'm broke this year, especially since I didn't get any birthday money this year (21 is apparently too old for cash, so I get nothing but a card). I will do something nice for most of my friends, but otherwise my boyfriend is the only one getting a gift, and that is because I thought of the perfect thing for him. My parents, luckily, take care of "my" gifts for them and the family (since I have no clue what any of them want) so I save money there. I found myself feeling bad about this though, feeling bad that I couldn't spend money on them... and that was when I wanted to slap myself.

Pockets, the first year I met him, made little cookie bags with a tree ornament for all his friends because he couldn't get anything more expensive than that; and it was honestly one of the nicest gifts I've ever gotten... they were REALLY good cookies, and he had made them himself. I know people that would bitch about that, and it disgusts me. We were thought of, that should be what matters, not how much they spent on us.
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2979 days
Last activity: 1128 days
Posted on 12-02-05 12:41 AM Link | Quote
although I do think that it has become too commercialized.... I also really like getting lots of presents

I honestly wish the "holiday season" had more focus on families and less on how many presents you get

although, eventhough the "best present you can get is to be with your family" or some other cheasy line like that.... I'd still like to get stuff for free
Rogue
If you're reading this... You are the Resistance











Since: 08-17-04

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 3 days
Posted on 12-03-05 08:19 PM Link | Quote
Fix it? Pssssh.. not going to happen. Sure the individual can make a dent here or there, but there's no way to "fix" this.

Christmas is just commerical. That's the way it's been since I can remember.

Then again, I get seasonal depression and therefore the whole season is just a downer anyway.


(Last edited by Rogue on 12-05-05 03:50 PM)
Xeoman

Wizzrobe
Administrator








Since: 08-14-04
From: 255

Since last post: 6 days
Last activity: 6 days
Posted on 12-03-05 08:23 PM Link | Quote
I usually actually like December and Christmas time, but this year ... I don't know, I'm just not really feeling anything.

Maybe it's because I'm a Senior in HS, older, and working now, but this month and November / Thanksgiving are just going by as "meh".


(Last edited by TheXG on 12-03-05 11:24 PM)
Rogue
If you're reading this... You are the Resistance











Since: 08-17-04

Since last post: 5 days
Last activity: 3 days
Posted on 12-03-05 08:26 PM Link | Quote
I think one of the reasons I've been so negative about Christmas this year was how fast the companies and corporations have been pushing Christmas like it was the next heroin since September and beyond. Seriously now, I'd like to take a look at Halloween costumes before even considering buying Christmas cards yet.
Ϡ
This isn't about you and your loud mouth,
This is about me and my fucking beard.








Since: 08-29-04
From: PA

Since last post: 2653 days
Last activity: 2276 days
Posted on 12-04-05 08:18 PM Link | Quote
You know, last year I felt exactly the same as you guys did. I was depressed due to deaths in the family, I was just discovering anarchism, commericilism, I was bitter, depressed, and angry.

I don't understand the bitterness anymore.

I mean, I've grown to see that America is run on the colors of blood and money, and you know, I've given up caring. There is no way that I alone can change the greed and violence by disagreeing with it and just sitting there angry. I am full heartedly feeling the Christmas spirit like I did as a kid.

My look on it is if you are always negative about everything, it takes away your capacity to feel joy. I'm going to take the high road and enjoy the feelings and people of the season and not fret over this commericilist shit. Let them do what they want, I know inside I can appreciate the true meaning of Christmas and be happy.

^.^-The Cairoi
avatar of law

Beezo








Since: 12-29-04
From: paris, canada

Since last post: 3572 days
Last activity: 3572 days
Posted on 12-05-05 11:08 PM Link | Quote
as with anything, i dont care what ppl do in their private lives, but when they're forcing it on others, that's another matter. ie: secret santas for work/school/or whatever. i mean wtf's that about? if you want to do that, do it with your personal friends or family members, dont make everyone at work or class do it too -.-'

then there's the whole "secret meaning" of christmas, ie, the birth of someone -.-' and commercializing it into a jolly guy who gives presents so you can celebrate that holiday, just like the easter bunny...

all i know is that i'm tired of how ppl are being extra nice just because it's that season again. it's so fake!

i'm sorry of you're jewish, but celebrating how a drum of oils lasted seven days instead of one to compete with the birth of a messiah is ridiculous. this whole month is ridiculous.
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 284 days
Last activity: 123 days
Posted on 12-05-05 11:39 PM Link | Quote


Careful with your wording, avatar. I don't know if we have any Jewish people here, but just in case, I'd much rather you not call their beliefs ridiculous.
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2979 days
Last activity: 1128 days
Posted on 12-06-05 12:41 AM Link | Quote
oh give it up Avatar

you make Christmas sound like some burden you have to bear

it's a holiday about giving presents (or at least it is now).... people say happy holidays rather than Merry Christmas.... the songs about Jesus are no longer sung in most public schools or heard on the radio.... how less Christian do you want the holiday to be?
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 284 days
Last activity: 123 days
Posted on 12-06-05 12:55 AM Link | Quote
He never said anything about it becoming "less Christian", geeogree. He complains about the fake generosity and the overcommercialization, yes. But wanting it less Christian? Nowhere. He also commented on "secret santas" in schools and work, which isn't complaining about the Christian aspect so much as it is complaining about expecting presents from someone who may not even celebrate the holiday.

Reading comprehension. First grade skill. Very useful.

Edits: Missed a point, correcting a wording.


(Last edited by Tamarin Calanis on 12-06-05 03:56 AM)
Ϡ
This isn't about you and your loud mouth,
This is about me and my fucking beard.








Since: 08-29-04
From: PA

Since last post: 2653 days
Last activity: 2276 days
Posted on 12-06-05 07:39 AM Link | Quote
Avatar, not all the genrousity of the season is fake. Mothers and fathers who love their kids think hard about what to get them. They honestly Don't have to, but they do anyway.

Secondly, Your comment on the Jewish holiday of Hannukah. While I realize that I am not Jewish, the holiday is showing how a grim situation was saved by a miracle from their world, and seeing such a grand miracle take place solidifies their faith in their lord.

Honestly, I could care less about commercilization. Let the dirty politicians do as they please. Karma will come for them in time.
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 284 days
Last activity: 123 days
Posted on 12-06-05 01:39 PM Link | Quote
Cairoi, what the fuck do "dirty politicians" have to do with holiday overcommercialization? Did you mean to say something else or do you have some sort of crazy conspiracy theory?
avatar of law

Beezo








Since: 12-29-04
From: paris, canada

Since last post: 3572 days
Last activity: 3572 days
Posted on 12-06-05 02:38 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by geeogree

you make Christmas sound like some burden you have to bear

it's a holiday about giving presents (or at least it is now).... people say happy holidays rather than Merry Christmas.... the songs about Jesus are no longer sung in most public schools or heard on the radio.... how less Christian do you want the holiday to be?


though i was not talking about christians, i guess i shall now...

yes... christmas doesnt sound like some burden i have to bear, IT IS a burden i have to bear. it's just like second hand smoking, actually, it's even worst. everywhere you go they're all, it's christmas, be happy. tis the season to be jolly. blah blah blah... it doesnt even matter what they say, the point is what they're saying has a dirty secret message, 'help us celebrate our lord's birth,' or 'haha, you're celebrating our lord's birth and you dont even know it, loser.'

and yes, public schools do sing songs about it. take the twelve days of christmas:

"The popular song "The Twelve Days of Christmas" is usually seen as simply a nonsense song for children. However, some have suggested that it is a song of Christian instruction dating to the 16th century religious wars in England, with hidden references to the basic teachings of the Faith. They contend that it was a mnemonic device to teach the catechism to youngsters. The "true love" mentioned in the song is not an earthly suitor, but refers to God Himself. The "me" who receives the presents refers to every baptized person who is part of the Christian Faith. Each of the "days" represents some aspect of the Christian Faith that was important for children to learn."

The partridge in a pear tree is Jesus the Christ, the Son of God, whose birthday we celebrate on December 25, the first day of Christmas. In the song, Christ is symbolically presented as a mother partridge that feigns injury to decoy predators from her helpless nestlings

Two Turtle Doves represents The Old and New Testaments, which together bear witness to God's self-revelation in history and the creation of a people to tell the Story of God to the world.

Three French Hens
The Three Theological Virtues: 1) Faith, 2) Hope, and 3) Love

ECT... http://www.cresourcei.org/cy12days.html
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2979 days
Last activity: 1128 days
Posted on 12-06-05 02:43 PM Link | Quote
yeah, I hate being forced to be happy...

stupid holiday!
Astrophel
Fear will kill your mind and steal your love as sure as anything;
Fear will rob you blind and make you numb to others suffering









Since: 10-03-04
From: Azul Lux Orbital, Kirin Beta

Since last post: 284 days
Last activity: 123 days
Posted on 12-06-05 02:46 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Tamarin Calanis - it's still very relevant
Reading comprehension. First grade skill. Very useful.


geeogree, I'm afraid I'm going to get very pissed if you don't start reading the posts and replying to the post itself instead of some bullshit misinterpretation.


(Last edited by Tamarin Calanis on 12-06-05 05:46 PM)
geeogree

Ninji








Since: 10-19-04

Since last post: 2979 days
Last activity: 1128 days
Posted on 12-06-05 03:31 PM Link | Quote
you're afraid?

then don't do it! and we can all be one happy posting family
Ϡ
This isn't about you and your loud mouth,
This is about me and my fucking beard.








Since: 08-29-04
From: PA

Since last post: 2653 days
Last activity: 2276 days
Posted on 12-06-05 03:34 PM Link | Quote
^.^ Heh heh, meant buisness men, but to me they're the same.

Oh, and Avatar, Holidays can be celebrated for different reasons.

And another thing, anybody else ever notice the similarities between the Biblical God and Santa Claus? Discuss.
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